If it's good enough for our troops, it's good enough for the enemy. Liberals want to give terrorist the rights of US citizens so why not.

heh... you know they gave swine flu immunizations to gitmo detainees... you and me cannot buy them though because they are rationed.

I say we become the real good guys. Lets just try diploacy and if that doesn't work we try more diplomacy. And if that doesn't work then we simply give in to their demands. Maybe if we avoid violent actions maybe they will not hate us, they will like us and want to be our allies. Why go to war, why kill people, why build such powerful weapons. I say we give peace and friendship a try.

If you guys want any more suggestions I'll be playing Call of Duty World at War.

you know that there is a big difference between being exposed to something you know is part of your training in a controlled environment where you know that they are your friends/allies and won't actually kill you and being exposed to it without knowing that. The fact that they are being prepared for waterboarding totally shows that the military considers it torture else there wouldn't be a need to prepare them for it.

Its kind of the same like saying that whipping is a legitimate punishment because there are people who pay for getting whipped.

Confessions made under torture have been proven to be rather unreliable although there are exceptions.

That could be true but then many people still get scared in haunted house, rollercoasters and horror movies. Unless you can claim they did not know what would happen in any of these situations even a person aware of what might happen can still get caught off guard and be scared.

I have to admit, that does make sense.

Actually it has been proven that they can be reliable as well. So this one is more of a 50/50 thing. It all really depends. You can't use this kind of argument when it can actually go both ways.

As a solution the interrogators can wear Obama masks, so the terrorist being interrogated will feel surrounded by friendly faces.

So how successful is the cake and ice cream method? What lengths would you go to foil a terrorist plot? Now, what  if a family member were at that location? The terrorist DO have a choice, and people seem to forget this. Don't harm innocents. If they DO choose to preform these act, they should know the consequences if they are captured. If the terrorists gave the same consideration as some folk give to their "human rights" there would be no acts of terror to worry about. Unfortunately these thoughts just give comfort to the terrorist, that he/she will be treated humanly, unlike their victims. IMO when a person commits such a heinous act, they forfeit their own humanity, by their own choice.

Torturing a person violates their human rights. That is the reason it is illegal. Suggesting to the brain that you are about to die is not some harmless hoax. You can kill a person if you don't let that person sleep for days on end. The chinese water torture drives people insane without hot pokers. I can't believe that civilized democratic people that I assume you to be could even consider rationalizing torture as a legitimate means to obtain information. It opens up a hole if you allow it once - because where do you stop? What price are you willing to pay for security? How much of a role do your so called values play - or is up to the judge to decide who is treated accordingly and who isn't? Oh right wait, that is exactly what happend in Guantanamo bay - a loophole exploited to make a concentration camp legal. And hello surprise - alot of people held there were in fact innocent. A few broken bones, mock executions.. Will it become general rules of engagement for the police to beat up suspects next? It's theoretically the same after all. A little Gestapo tactics will losen anybodys tongue, right? Never mind that you torture innocent people as well, but that's just what securing democracy costs, right?

I agree, lets never torture humans. Let's never torture combatants that adhere to the articles of war (Geneva Convention). Now sub-human animals that kill innocents intentionally, water board away... they forfeit their humanity by choice. We take no pleasure in performing this, and should use it as a last resort. More humanity for the beasts than they give. Nice guys finish last.

Since waterboarding = torture is apparently a given, where are the news reports of our Attorney General filing suit to stop the military from torturing our own soldiers?

He has filed suit to stop this torture hasn't he?

I hear and understand what you're suggesting... and it is a reasonable suggestion. I'm against it however, because there are too many potential adversaries out there that are not as meek as the US is. Our troops need to be prepared for the worse, because they can expect that "dirty" end of the stick. Besides liberals like Holder believe our troops are the enemy.

That was meant to be tongue in cheek. I really should have added the /sarcasm tag.

But your last line pegs it superbly as to why there are no lawsuits to stop our own military from 'torturing' it's own people. That in itself is the most telling point about the true motivation of the 'stop the torture' crowd.

If stopping the torture were truly the objective, there would at least be an equal, if not greater, outcry to stop the 'torture' of our own soldiers as there is to stop the 'torture' of terrorists.

Sub-Humans? Besides the fact that there is no such thing - who decides who is in that category and who isn't? What about those who were only suspected of being a terrorist but were captured anyway and tortured, mock executed etc. and turned out to be innocent?

Yeah I figured that much (based on previous posts), but I'm almost certain there are some folks that feel that way, because it sounds reasonable.

Figure of speech. You may call the (self-proclaimed) murders brother, friend, man-of-the-year...whatever you wish.

Why are they suspect? Give an example or something, but don't presume that I (or yourself for that matter) knows why a particular person is picked up. Of course mistakes are made, but your argument is if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...wait it might be a chicken. Please.

Why were woman burnt as witches? Because someone accused them of being a witch (usually to their own personal profit) and then they were tortured and viola, confessed to being a witch.

How are suspected terrorists being picked up in Afpak? I would hazard a guess that it has some similarities in regards of why information is passed on - otherwise you would have less people about whom someone said that they were terrorists in custody. And to the black slave traders back in the triangle trade times who caught slaves to sell them to the british slavers. The selling of information has always been a business. Now I suppose that there are also persons picked up who actually know something of value, which still does not legitimze torture.